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Poster: BornEasement Date: Aug 19, 2009 3:44pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: 70 v 80

never posted here before, except for a review, but I'm interested in the archive community's response:

gun to your head, all chips down, do you go home with the 1970 acoustic sets or the 1980 ones?

personally i think the 1970 ones smell like gunpowder and taste like good whiskey while the 1980 ones smell like artificial air fresheners and taste like michelob ultra...

what about you guys?

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Poster: robthewordsmith Date: Aug 19, 2009 4:57pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

70 - beyond a doubt.

Take Tell with the proverbial pinch of salt. He is without question sound on many things, but he knows full well that Dire is (as Tell is himself) one of the pillars upon which this forum is founded.

I love them both (in a brotherly way) (yes I know that's yucky - live with it...)

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Poster: direwolf0701 Date: Aug 19, 2009 5:22pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

thanks honeybunch ;)


(geeez - am I the only one going with 1980??? i feel lonely now)

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Poster: SkyDawg Date: Aug 19, 2009 11:08pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

No contest, 1970 all the way. There's only one thing about the 1980 sets that the ones from 1970 lack... the great acoustic Bird Songs the band played in 1980 .. if only it had been written a little earlier.
Actually I like all the acoustic sets, 1970 was just when they were really good and covered a much greater song selection. Too bad the band didn't mix the sets up more in 1980.

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Poster: Miss Divine Date: Aug 19, 2009 11:20pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

1970 wins for me. More of a gospel feel and the NRPS.

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Poster: jglynn1.2 Date: Aug 20, 2009 8:39am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

Yeah

Cold Jordan w/ Marmaduke May 70

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Poster: Old_NJ_Head_Zimmer Date: Aug 19, 2009 5:11pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

Gun to my head - I take 70 for all the reasons already mentioned.

But oh those sweet China Dolls and To Lay Me Downs!!!! Not to mentions IKOs of 80

Let the world go by like clouds a-streaming !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Poster: lostmoon Date: Aug 19, 2009 7:10pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

Depends what day of the week and my mood, but as I grow older (55) some of the 70's stuff never sounded better. Both have merit (the 80's & 70's), but the 70's is more vintage GD. I'm even gaining a new appreciation of the 60's.

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Poster: boltman Date: Aug 19, 2009 7:19pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

70s...a nice raw flavor, NRPS songs and harmonies, Long Black Limousine, Friend of the Devil and my grandson's favorite Monkey & the Engineer (I know they continued to play that into the 80's but it somehow remains a 70s song to me). Katie Mae, some really nice Deep Elem. For me it is when so many of those songs really came to life...a certain good naturedness in the performance, sounding damn nostalgic at the moment.

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Poster: light into ashes Date: Aug 19, 2009 10:50pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

You probably know where I stand....
http://www.archive.org/iathreads/post-view.php?id=255232

The 1980 sets are certainly squeaky-clean....what I'd call mild easy-listening music. 1980 also has the advantage of having much longer acoustic sets with post-1970 songs like Bird Song - most of the 1970 sets drew from a rather small pool of songs.

But it can't match the more rough & ready, 'authentic'-sounding 1970 sets, with much more interaction with the audience, better-sounding acoustics (not that lame 'plugged-in' '80 sound, which reminds me of the electric 1971 versions of Dark Hollow & Ripple), Pigpen on piano in the later shows, gospel tunes, the New Riders adding mandolin etc, sometimes Garcia on electric for a nice blended sound, forgotten folk oldies popping up now & then.... No contest!

The 11-17-78 show is interesting since it shows what more spontaneous 1980 sets COULD have been like.

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Poster: billydlions Date: Aug 19, 2009 6:53pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

Dont pay any attention to William Tell (he thinks he's Prime Minister around here). Listen to the first few songs of this great show. While Phil is working on getting his bass working, Bob & Jerry jam much better than any 1970 show. As for the electric set it's not too shabby either with one of the better stand alone Fire's (from Deadset) and Uncle John's is one of the best encores you'll hear.

http://www.archive.org/details/gd80-10-31.sbd-preFM.cousinit.20377.sbeok.shnf

This post was modified by billydlions on 2009-08-20 01:53:52

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Poster: skies Date: Aug 20, 2009 8:29am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

Thanks Billydions ,this concert you recommend is really nice ,and I still listen to it now

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Poster: direwolf0701 Date: Aug 19, 2009 6:32pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

good call

great show all around :)

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Poster: BornEasement Date: Aug 19, 2009 6:26pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

I'm afraid i can't agree my friend. Pig's harmonica, the semi-consistent presence of those shady new riders characters, and the fact that every acoustic set seems to hold some never-again-played folksy gem set the 1970 adventure head and shoulders above the 1980 endeavor. I respect the sensitive ballads and clean playing...

but pig manlyness v sensitive ballad?

i know which way I swing.

and is the dead REALLY about CLEAN playing? OR is it about that last great american adventure...

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Poster: billydlions Date: Aug 19, 2009 6:48pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

Well then why did you ask, my friend? ( I feel like John McCain) Sensitive ballads? maybe a few songs but certainly not the whole set.

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Poster: BornEasement Date: Aug 19, 2009 7:07pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

just wanted to start a discussion with some folks that love this stuff as much as me and get a few good show recs...

and it worked!

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Poster: direwolf0701 Date: Aug 19, 2009 4:32pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

welcome!!

personally, i would go with 1980. I like the "feel" of it better - maybe because they are a bit more polished in most of the recordings I have heard comparing the two. almost sounds a bit "happier" (i cant put that in other terms - sorry) nothing against 70 though by any stretch (though I am by no means a Pig fan)

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Poster: BornEasement Date: Aug 19, 2009 5:23pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

question... do you fellas take available sound quality into account with these kinds of inquiries?

not that 70 is necessarily worse when it comes to that than 80, just that on a whole it can impact our perception of what went down...

Ciaran Carson (anyone else read him?) argues that a live recording (his specialty is Irish trad. but i think many of his thoughts apply to the dead) is never a whole representation of a performance, just one angle on it. Even supremely clear recordings can never transfer the smells, sights, and tastes of BEING at a place at a certain time.

He discusses the concept of conviviality and the common soul at play within improvisational music... when I read that my music player went straight for Dark Star... Thoughts?

sorry... didn't mean to go all out there...

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Poster: direwolf0701 Date: Aug 19, 2009 6:14pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

i suppose i can be guilty of that with certain shows or questions of this nature. when i hear a show of questionable sound quality, i find it hard to think of it as a good show since, at that moment of listening, it doesnt sound good. the show then carries a, oftentimes unwarranted, negative connotation in my memory (or what is left of it.)

however, the reverse tends to not be as consistently true. a "bad" show, even if the sound quality is pristine, is often remembered as a bad show (to me.)


(damn, kinda makes me a sound-whore dont it?)

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Poster: user unknown Date: Aug 19, 2009 8:26pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

70...some great acoustic tunes in those shows and Pigpen too

case in point 8/18/70 was the first time played for Truckin', Ripple, Brokedown Palace and Operator

It is an AUD, and has some issues but worth the listen
http://www.archive.org/details/gd70-...346.sbeok.shnf

This post was modified by user unknown on 2009-08-19 23:28:34

This post was modified by user unknown on 2009-08-20 03:26:34

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Poster: elbow1126 Date: Aug 20, 2009 5:53am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

70s. Aside from all of the comments mentioned above, they feel more spontaneous to me. You can hear Jerry and Bob trying to figure it out as they go. Although not officially a '70 show, check out the acoustic set from 12-26-69 (sorry no time to post a link right now). Listen to the discussions between songs between the two, especially before Gathering Flowers for the Master's Bouquet. Jerry isn't even sure if he knows the tune, yet they pull of a lovely version.

That all said, I do love the acoustic Bird Song's from '80 and '81 so I do listen to those sets as well.

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Poster: skuzzlebutt Date: Aug 19, 2009 6:16pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

1970 and it's not even close. With all due respect to the thoroughly enjoyable 1980 sets, they can't hold a candle to the vitality and freshness of 1970. Pigpen, Marmaduke, more varied setlists (including tunes like "Cold Jordan" and "How Long Blues" that would be gone for good after this phase of the band's career).

The 1980 shows were nice, but with a few tunes rotated here and there it was basically the same set every night.

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Poster: Morning Dewd Date: Aug 19, 2009 7:28pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

No contest. 1970.

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Poster: bluedevil Date: Aug 19, 2009 7:42pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

another vote for 70. and just think of what you'd get after the acoustic set....

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Poster: Styrofoam Cueball Date: Aug 19, 2009 6:52pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

Welcome, BornEasement; great question.

My favorite acoustic show is this one:

http://www.archive.org/details/gd1970-01-31.sbd.cotsman.fixed.24028.sbeok.shnf

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Poster: Capt. Cook Date: Aug 19, 2009 6:53pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

I'll go with the 80's sets mainly because they managed to tune better and sing better than during the 70's sets, plus the piano adds a lot to the whole vibe.

PS Can I get an Amber Bock, instead of that stupid Ultra?

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Poster: DeadRed1971 Date: Aug 19, 2009 7:03pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

If I could have just one, it would have to be 1-31-70 in New Orleans. Busted for drugs, busted bass amp, problems with the P.A. system, only one acoustic guitar, and still they made magic that night. Just listen to Katie Mae.

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Poster: waynecs Date: Aug 20, 2009 5:01am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

How many Katie Maes did they do in '80?Case closed.1970.

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Poster: William Tell Date: Aug 19, 2009 4:45pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

Welcome!

First order of business: don't ever listen to Dire!

70s all the way!

You just can't get the great gospel tunes with the likes of Nelson and Marmaduke sitting in!

Besides, the vocal degradation over that decade can only hurt.

So, for me, it's hands down 70!

Check out Feb, May, June and Sept for outstanding performances.

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Poster: direwolf0701 Date: Aug 19, 2009 5:21pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

"First order of business: don't ever listen to Dire!"



buttmonkey

;)

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Poster: snori Date: Aug 19, 2009 4:17pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

Welcome, and what a good opening question. I'd have to go with the earlier option because Pigpen is there, because NRPS are sometimes there, and because the selection of songs is more varied - eg 'Wake up little Susie' to 'Cold Jordan'.

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Poster: Earl B. Powell Date: Aug 19, 2009 7:02pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

All things here are from the perspective of memory, so the theory of the tune just being a slice of the pie has to be correct. I find the 70 acoustic stuff nearly as primal as the electric, but it's amazing how refined Workingman's and American Beauty are compared to these live examples. In line with "traditional" music though, the 70's shows did have a more authentic "air."

In a lot of cases it's simply a question of familiarity, just like the electric sets. Those later to the bus will trend toward the 80's shows, those who rode the chariot will always trend toward the earlier. From a sound perspective I prefer the 80's listening experience. From a historic perspective the 70's shows appeal to a larger part of my experience. Right down the middle, I prefer the studio versions over either.

What's the difference between ignorance and apathy?

I don't know and I don't care.

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Poster: direwolf0701 Date: Aug 19, 2009 7:27pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

"From a sound perspective I prefer the 80's listening experience. From a historic perspective the 70's shows..."


nicely put from where I am seated

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Poster: BataviaSparky Date: Aug 20, 2009 6:18am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

Throwing murderer for a loop - my choice is Garcia/Rice/Grisman - Pizza tapes. Incredible Shady Grove and all else. Also love any Garcia Grisman.

80 over 70 if murdererous gun-toter absolutely insists!

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Poster: Jim F Date: Aug 19, 2009 9:00pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

"Michelob Ultra"

hahahaha

70's for me, but at the same time I can't knock the 80's ones. The 80's acoustic sets are really the only thing I LIKE about 80's Dead.


How Long Blues!!!

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Poster: TOOTMO Date: Aug 20, 2009 12:09pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

Shoot me! I always skip the acoustic sets. I'm not a musically-trained fan and maybe I don't know caviar when I hear it, but...


TOOTMO

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Poster: myrtlewood Date: Aug 20, 2009 12:28am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: 70 v 80

the 80's rock! the 70's trip! pick your poison. I prefer 89. Deal and Dark Star see Miami and Alpine.